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Old 09-15-2011, 01:53 PM   #1
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Question Sleepy 16 day old...

I think she has her days and nights reversed....ahhh. lol But anyways, I'm having trouble waking her up for feeds when she's "sleep cycling." She will happily go 4 hours without a feed snoozing away during this time. I try not to let her go over 3 hours though because she's only 5.15lbs and the doctors are concerned about her growth rate.

(She was IUGR born at 38.6, 5.13oz, lost down to 5.5oz, ended up in hospital with fever last weekend, gained weight there to 6lbs but lost 2oz since that.)
(They did weigh her with a diaper on in the hossy though and she was getting IV fluids so that could very well make up for the 2oz loss.)

The point is that the doctors want her to gain 1oz by tomorrow or they will suggest supplementation. Which is FINE I want what's best for her but I'd rather not because last time supplementation was the bell toll of doom for breast feeding with DD1. (I had a rough c-section, they gave her formula the first night which lead to latch/suck issues etc.)

This DD does latch well, sucks well but then she gets lazy and I constantly have to tickle her to keep her suck swallowing. She will just happily fall asleep if I let her do so after about 5 mins of hard sucking.

There is like no way she's getting enough in 5 minutes right? I normally keep tickling her to make her suck/swallow at least 10 mins. Even then I have my doubts.

Any suggestions?

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Old 09-15-2011, 01:57 PM   #2
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Keep doing what you're doing. Just encourage her to nurse often. After she gets lazy on one side, burp her, play/talk to her a little to wake her good, then offer the other side. How much bare skin to as skin contact are you doing? Are you wearing her?
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Old 09-15-2011, 02:08 PM   #3
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We went through the same thing with ds. He was a 35 weeker, very jaundiced, and SOOO sleepy. He was in NICU for 11days and if he didn't gain their protocol was to bottle feed expressed milk, ng tube pumped milk if bottle didn't work, and them go to calorie supps if that wasn't enough. I really wanted him to gain feeding from the breast alone so I would do everything I could to get him to feed every 2-3 hours. I would take a cold damp towel and rub it over his face (a nurse showed me this trick). He would do good for maybe 5 minutes and then I would try to get him to cont bf by tickling his cheek, switching sides, back to wet towel, and repeat. The nurses wanted him actively nursing for 20 minutes! I would have him at the breast for 45 minutes to an hour but maybe only get 10-15 of active feeding. The trick was to keep him close to the breast as much as possible and to repeat the whole process frequently. Amazingly he was transferring a good amount of milk even if only actively feeding for short bursts. They did give him 1-2 feeds by bottle at night when I would go home. We continued to do a small bottle of pumped milk at night when ds came home. Only for a couple weeks though and not every night. Once we reached his actual due date he was much better. Good luck mama! I was so worried when ds was born, but it all worked out and by 10weeks pp we were both comfly with the bf relationship. Oh, also I would pump for 10 minutes after feedings especially if the feed was light. That really help build/maintain my supply while ds was so sleepy.

ETA- we did have some nipple confusion with the bottle. I will def try to avoid a bottle with this one, but ds and I worked it out last time. I don't regret giving him the bottle early on, but sometimes re-learning to latch after a nightime bottle feed was frustrating and tired poor ds out. Oh, and also getting out in the sunlight, having baby skin to skin, and nursing that way could help your lo with daytime/nighttime confusion and with active nursing. Just a thought. We would have gotten out way more when ds was a news but it was wintertime and way too cold to be out more than a couple of minutes.

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Old 09-15-2011, 02:20 PM   #4
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Re: Sleepy 16 day old...

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Originally Posted by Connor View Post
Keep doing what you're doing. Just encourage her to nurse often. After she gets lazy on one side, burp her, play/talk to her a little to wake her good, then offer the other side. How much bare skin to as skin contact are you doing? Are you wearing her?

Today I am alone with her and my 20 month old so not much time to skin to skin. But I can later once DH is home. I want to wear her but I only have a Moby (too hot right now) and my Ergo and I think she's too small for the Ergo just yet. (I also have a Bjorn but that is way out of the question lol.)

I've been waking her every 2.5-3 hours during her sleep cycle. I use a damp butt wipe on her face, head, arms, tummy to wake her sometimes, somtimes tickles, etc. A diaper change really pisses her off which is GOOD because she will latch and suck harder if she's totally awake and angry. We jokingly call it "anger latching" in our house. lol


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Originally Posted by preemiemama View Post
We went through the same thing with ds. He was a 35 weeker, very jaundiced, and SOOO sleepy. He was in NICU for 11days and if he didn't gain their protocol was to bottle feed expressed milk, ng tube pumped milk if bottle didn't work, and them go to calorie supps if that wasn't enough. I really wanted him to gain feeding from the breast alone so I would do everything I could to get him to feed every 2-3 hours. I would take a cold damp towel and rub it over his face (a nurse showed me this trick). He would do good for maybe 5 minutes and then I would try to get him to cont bf by tickling his cheek, switching sides, back to wet towel, and repeat. The nurses wanted him actively nursing for 20 minutes! I would have him at the breast for 45 minutes to an hour but maybe only get 10-15 of active feeding. The trick was to keep him close to the breast as much as possible and to repeat the whole process frequently. Amazingly he was transferring a good amount of milk even if only actively feeding for short bursts. They did give him 1-2 feeds by bottle at night when I would go home. We continued to do a small bottle of pumped milk at night when we got home. Only for a couple weeks though and not every night. Once we reached his actual due date he was much better. Good luck mama! I was so worried when ds was born, but it all worked out and by 10weeks pp we were both comfly with the bf relationship. Oh, also I would pump for 10 minutes after feedings especially if the feed was light. That really help build/maintain my supply while ds was so sleepy.

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Thank you for sharing! <3

Yes I can pump. I have a nice one but I was told that pumping during the first month can mess up supply? I get so much conflicting information. I did pump once in the hospital last weekend because she was too weak to latch. (It was horrifying.) Anyways, she drank 3 oz no problem. With DD1 we did pump/formula supp etc, but that killed my supply and her "urge" to suckle so we only made it 4 months breast feeding. That was the road I was trying to avoid this time around. So far its working great for me, I'm very supplied its' just she is a lazy drinker.

This is offtopic to her feeding but I also suspect that I may have a touch of PPD this go around too. That's hard for me admit but as the days go by and I'm still not "better yet" I believe it may be so.

I did speak with my doctor and she did give me Lexapro but as I've mentioned before I'm too scared to take a SSRI with a breast feeding infant so I'm trying to push through this without that sort of thing. I just wish it was easier. KWIM? I'm doubting everything I do, sad about everything and anxious something is going wrong.
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Old 09-15-2011, 02:35 PM   #5
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Oh mama, big ((HUGS)). I felt conflicted about all the pumping early on and questioned myself frequently. Looking back I am sure the pumping in the beginning helped bc ds was too sleepy to nurse like some of my fam/friend's babies. Once he was strong and less sleepy (after due date) I did not pump much and the supply/demand evened out really well.

I feel you on the taking SSRI's while BF'ing. But it really sounds like you could use some help in evening out those hormones and brain chemicals that are keeping you down and overwhelmed. Do you take any supplements. I find that a good vitamin b complex and omega 3 oil help me a lot with mood and energy levels. BF'ing should help with the "feel good" hormones, but pregnancy and birth really do a number on the emotions. Have you asked your pedi what the best thing is to take for ppd while bf? I remember when we consulted with the neonatologist before taking ds home from NICU. I asked what I could and couldn't ea/drink/take and he said 99% of the time it is perfectly safe to take what I need to for my health and continue to bf. He said to ask the pedi if in doubt, but that it is usually best to just continue to feed from the breast.

ETA- oh and I LOL at the angry nurser. Little stinkers get SOOO pissy about a diaper change. So cute.

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Old 09-15-2011, 02:45 PM   #6
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Re: Sleepy 16 day old...

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Originally Posted by preemiemama View Post
Oh mama, big ((HUGS)). I felt conflicted about all the pumping early on and questioned myself frequently. Looking back I am sure the pumping in the beginning helped bc ds was too sleepy to nurse like some of my fam/friend's babies. Once he was strong and less sleepy (after due date) I did not pump much and the supply/demand evened out really well.

I feel you on the taking SSRI's while BF'ing. But it really sounds like you could use some help in evening out those hormones and brain chemicals that are keeping you down and overwhelmed. Do you take any supplements. I find that a good vitamin b complex and omega 3 oil help me a lot with mood and energy levels. BF'ing should help with the "feel good" hormones, but pregnancy and birth really do a number on the emotions. Have you asked your pedi what the best thing is to take for ppd while bf? I remember when we consulted with the neonatologist before taking ds home from NICU. I asked what I could and couldn't ea/drink/take and he said 99% of the time it is perfectly safe to take what I need to for my health and continue to bf. He said to ask the pedi if in doubt, but that it is usually best to just continue to feed from the breast.

ETA- oh and I LOL at the angry nurser. Little stinkers get SOOO pissy about a diaper change. So cute.

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*thanks mama hugs!*

If I don't feel improved by next week, I'll give her Pedi a call and double check, if she clears the Lexapro I'll consider it.

I am not supplementing my diet. I should but I haven't. I am actually having trouble eating ANYTHING. DH practically forces me to eat like that parrot from Aladin. lol I need to remember to take those prenatals daily again. I've just been so overwhelmed it has slipped my mind.
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Old 09-15-2011, 02:55 PM   #7
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It was really strange to me, but I didn't have an appetite after giving birth either. I thought since I was nursing I would, but in the beginning I had to remember to eat. I would make myself eat spoonfuls of peanut butter, put trail mix in the car, and eat granola bars. I tried to think of little things that would give me protein and energy but didn't take much thought/prep. I did frozen fruit/yogurt smoothies too. Just pop it all in the blender and make make a big batch, put it in a HUGE cup, and just keep taking sips. 10weeks pp was a big deal for me and that is when I started being less weepy and more normal. Things started to look much better at 6weeks pp though. That's when I got my appetite back. I hope you feel better soon. I will be in your shoes in Feb. And I hope I remember my own advice. Its always easier said than done.

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Old 09-15-2011, 03:05 PM   #8
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Re: Sleepy 16 day old...

My second baby I pumped early (1 week?) and had the same supply i I had for my first. I only work per diem, so I worked a few shifts when he was 2 weeks old, and he took a bottle without problems nursing.
I was afraid to take much of anything while nursing, either (I had one doc call me stupid grr)
I also wanted to say hang in there...and don't forget to take care of yourself (and yes to continuing those prenatal vitamins!) It must be stressful with 2 close in age and worrying about your newborns weight gain. Hope everything gets easier, and soon!!
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Old 09-15-2011, 04:30 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MamaBearSquared

Today I am alone with her and my 20 month old so not much time to skin to skin. But I can later once DH is home. I want to wear her but I only have a Moby (too hot right now) and my Ergo and I think she's too small for the Ergo just yet. (I also have a Bjorn but that is way out of the question lol.)

I've been waking her every 2.5-3 hours during her sleep cycle. I use a damp butt wipe on her face, head, arms, tummy to wake her sometimes, somtimes tickles, etc. A diaper change really pisses her off which is GOOD because she will latch and suck harder if she's totally awake and angry. We jokingly call it "anger latching" in our house. lol

Thank you for sharing! <3

Yes I can pump. I have a nice one but I was told that pumping during the first month can mess up supply? I get so much conflicting information. I did pump once in the hospital last weekend because she was too weak to latch. (It was horrifying.) Anyways, she drank 3 oz no problem. With DD1 we did pump/formula supp etc, but that killed my supply and her "urge" to suckle so we only made it 4 months breast feeding. That was the road I was trying to avoid this time around. So far its working great for me, I'm very supplied its' just she is a lazy drinker.

This is offtopic to her feeding but I also suspect that I may have a touch of PPD this go around too. That's hard for me admit but as the days go by and I'm still not "better yet" I believe it may be so.

I did speak with my doctor and she did give me Lexapro but as I've mentioned before I'm too scared to take a SSRI with a breast feeding infant so I'm trying to push through this without that sort of thing. I just wish it was easier. KWIM? I'm doubting everything I do, sad about everything and anxious something is going wrong.
You can use the Moby to do skin to skin. Just Go topless and wear her in the wrap, then you can still tend to your older kidlet too.
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Old 09-16-2011, 12:46 PM   #10
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Re: Sleepy 16 day old...

SUCCESS! She gained 2.5oz in 2 days!!!

Shes 6.25 lbs now!
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